Curse

capitalist · Aug 10, 2006, 03:18 PM // 15:18

A common theme throughout Guru's threads is that most people with large sums of money got it from ebay. Now in their defense, the people that are posting this crap are usually new (0-3 months playing). They are generally envious and/or jealous; figuring the only way to make themselves feel better is to try to bash the people who have been playing this game for over a year. In order to cut down on the number of new threads regarding "How can I be rich?", "Why are things so expensive?", "How come my pre-sear character doesnt spawn with FoW armor?", I will answer all the general questions here.

1. Why are items 100k+? Who would buy at these outrageous prices?

Items are 100k+ecto because there are still a number of items in this game that are extremely hard to find (though the numbers are decreasing daily). Crystallines, Dwarvens, Serpents, Magmas, Mursaat items, req 7 15%, and to a lesser extent, Storm Bows, Shadow Shields, Fellblades, Zodiac items. If you have a req 7 or req 8 15>50 item, chances are it could go for over 100k because there are still a small number of collectors in the game that pay premiums for perfect req items. The people who buy at these prices have generally been playing the game for over a year, have accumulated a decent amount of money and ecto, have 15k armor for their characters, and have nothing to really spend their money on... besides perfect items.

2. But... but... I want perfect items too! ANET can you please give me perfect items?

Oh, but they already have given you perfect items. Green items with perfect stats, collectors items (with "cooler" skins in Cantha), and lets not forget that they gave you chests. ANET gave you Greens and chest with keys at the same time last September. Then, with the release of Factions, ANET changed Gold Items so they spawn with 14-15% mods, rather than the previous 12-15%. The same gold items often spawn with two near perfect mods (20/19 sundering and +29). And Purples! Yes, now Purple items can drop with 14>50 mods on them. I think ANET has done a fine job of handing you everything you asked for.

3. But... but... I don't want Green or Collector's items. They make me feel inferior. I want Gold Items. What can ANET do for me?

If you feel inferior for using Green/Collector's items, that is an issue you should talk to your therapist about. How many times have you been in a PUG and someone asked you if you were using a Green item? That is right, never. And you can get a 15>50 Gold item in most all of the desireable skins for 10-50k. They will, however, be req 10-13.

4. But... but... I want req 8 perfect items.

Then you are going to have to work a bit. ANET has provided you with many options to play the game with perfect items: 10/10 and 20/20 Staves, 15>50 Weapons, +30/10% Offhands, +30/-2 or 5(20%) Shields, etc. If these are not good enough for you, then you will have to farm or chest run or trade or find another way to make some money. You have everything here to put you on par with the people that have been playing for over a year. If you have to have the perfect req, perfect skin, perfect mod item to make yourself feel leet, then stop asking ANET for help.

5. What about FoW armor? Every noob with a credit card can buy it on ebay.

There are some people that do this. But the majority of people have accumulated the wealth over the last year. PvE-ers farming and running, PvP-ers winning HoH and cashing in Sigils and selling rare items, or just hanging out in LA d1 all day trading. So please don't tarnish their reputations by assuming that the majority ebays.

~Cap

Loviatar · Aug 10, 2006, 03:33 PM // 15:33

/THANK YOU

i am one of the have nots as.................

i dont have a single rare/rare skin item to my name
everything i have is junk (the prices prove this)

a 19/19 or even ....gasp.........a 18/19 sells for a pittence.

and if it is........horror of horrors.........only a purple it is a give it away price.

i have.........sob...........only basic Drok/Kaineng armor ..........worse yet i like the original undyed color.

i can afford better but maybe something in chapter 3/4 will really be just what i want so i save for then instead of blowing it now just to impress a few people now

Terra Xin · Aug 10, 2006, 03:36 PM // 15:36

I only collect greens, golds are too far out of my reach, and... well, if you feel special having a gold that is more rare than... anything in the game, then... good for you^^.

Cebe · Aug 10, 2006, 03:40 PM // 15:40

But...but...this is so going to turn into a nasty war between the "haves" and the "have nots" as you put it. The "haves" will continually brag about what they have and the "have nots" will throw insults around the place. Maybe one of the mods shoud use their "elite skill" on this thread and close it before that happens!!

milias · Aug 10, 2006, 03:43 PM // 15:43

Nicely put capitalist! Hopely this will cut down the amount of complaining and give us old school players some peace and quiet

Jetdoc · Aug 10, 2006, 03:44 PM // 15:44

Excellent post, capitalist. In short:

Almost every perumtation of "perfect" item is available either through a collector or a green item. Very few green items exceed 100K, let alone 50K.

Granted, all of those items have a 9 requirement, but in the end, how many times do you find yourself only having enough points in your build for an 8 or 7 requirement? To dispel a common myth, there is ABSOLUTELY no benefit to exceeding your requirement...whether you just barely meet the requirement or exceed it by 7 levels - it does EXACTLY THE SAME THING.

If you have a chip on your shoulder because you can't get the exact statistics you want on the exact skin you want, then you simply need to (1) find ways to accumulate the cash to get your heart's desire or (2) get over it. 99% of you should pursue #2, in order not to become bitter, as many of those have who post about the economy being broken. It's really hard for an individual to separate NEED from DESIRE, but it's very easy for third parties to spot that in your threads.

Venice Queen · Aug 10, 2006, 03:48 PM // 15:48

"and lets not forget that they gave you chests."

You mean took away chests? Chest running was a lot more fun before anet layed down the nerf and locked everything up.

MSecorsky · Aug 10, 2006, 03:51 PM // 15:51

Just a pending battle of 'elitists' vs. 'zens'.

Elitists want it all for them, Zens want balance for all.

The sides will never meet, this thread will degrade to flame wars, Inde or some other will close.

"I'm using Shroud of Silence on this thread!"

Rent · Aug 10, 2006, 03:55 PM // 15:55

I'm not sure why people who worked to earn what they have are labeled elitists.

Demesis · Aug 10, 2006, 04:01 PM // 16:01

I still can't help but think FoW armor wearers are noobs. I've seen far too many wammos wearing FoW armor and not knowing what they're doing.

Unless you can prove to me with reliable statistics that the majority of FoW wearers aern't Ebayers, I'll have to stick with my current observations.

MSecorsky · Aug 10, 2006, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rent

I'm not sure why people who worked to earn what they have are labeled elitists.

It isn't the ones who've worked to earn what they have... I'm in that category. It's the ones that think everyone else should have to work as hard or harder for equally nice items.

I know that sounds reasonable on the surface, but consider what this game is about... it's a balance based game, not an uber-item uber-levelling for power game. As such, the game requires balancing often on skills, has level and attrubute point caps, and requires that everyone can be kept on an even footing regarding equipment. Those with gold to burn can get their obsidian armor and the like, that's very nice. Those of us with limited time and in possession of lives outside of GW should still have an easy time of getting max weapons to allow us to compete in the arenas on an even footing however.

Cjlr · Aug 10, 2006, 04:07 PM // 16:07

It's because some people fail to realize just how long fifteen months is.

People complain because they don't have 100k after a week of playing. They can go to hell.

Earning money is absurdly easy. It's as simple as just playing the game. You'd have to be spending a whole lot of time doing nothing in order to not make at least 1k/hour. After hundreds, if not thousands, of hours, guess what? Some people have actually accumulated a positive balance! Go figure...

Curse You · Aug 10, 2006, 04:09 PM // 16:09

I personally am fine with just using my greens and collector items. Once Factions came out, there were just the right stats on certain greens and collector items that I could finnally make a set I liked the stats of.

When I get a gold that has Req 7 or 8, I sell it. I don't have a need for it because 1) I have my greens, 2) I know that lower req doesn't mean more damage.

I find the fact people will pay so much more for something that just LOOKS better, quite funny. (yea, I have one 15k armor set out of five characters)

Rent · Aug 10, 2006, 04:09 PM // 16:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Those of us with limited time and in possession of lives outside of GW should still have an easy time of getting max weapons to allow us to compete in the arenas on an even footing however.

But you do have an easy time. I don't understand the contention here.

Those who care only about stats can get collector's/weaponsmith stuff with little to no difficulty, and those who care about appearance can work to save money to afford Obsidian armor/Crystallines/whatever else. Doesn't it work as-is? I don't understand why there are any complaints from either camp.

Demesis · Aug 10, 2006, 04:11 PM // 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cjlr

It's because some people fail to realize just how long fifteen months is.

People complain because they don't have 100k after a week of playing. They can go to hell.

Earning money is absurdly easy. It's as simple as just playing the game. You'd have to be spending a whole lot of time doing nothing in order to not make at least 1k/hour. After hundreds, if not thousands, of hours, guess what? Some people have actually accumulated a positive balance! Go figure...

I don't get it.

MSecorsky · Aug 10, 2006, 04:13 PM // 16:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rent

Doesn't it work as-is? I don't understand why there are any complaints from either camp.

It does indeed, actually... the OPs original complaint (from other posts) stems around ANet having the chest event this weekend, making it easier for people to get golds from chests. His concerns over prices for his items losing mythical value is what began the haves-have nots/ elitists argument.

Personally, I believe that more available for all is great for the community. Others don't, and it's almost always the "haves" that complain the loudest.

Cjlr · Aug 10, 2006, 04:18 PM // 16:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Demesis

I don't get it.

New players complain because older players have more money than them.

After all, how much "money" you have is, in a game like this, almost always directly related to how much time you spent earning that money.

It's like complaining that your entry-level position doesn't pay as high as much as your manager earns.

milias · Aug 10, 2006, 04:22 PM // 16:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Personally, I believe that more available for all is great for the community. Others don't, and it's almost always the "haves" that complain the loudest.

I tend to disagree. Just like IRL, this is how Capitalism should and does work. Capitalism does not guarantee equal wealth for all, for that, you'd have to look into Socialism or Communism. While those forms of government look good on paper, they don't work in practice.

Moreover, by redistributing wealth, you help some people, but you hurt others. Some people will be happy, and some will be upset. I think right now, it's best to maintain the status quo, because in any case, ANet does not want to see upset customers, be it the "haves" or the "have-nots".

capitalist · Aug 10, 2006, 04:27 PM // 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

It does indeed, actually... the OPs original complaint (from other posts) stems around ANet having the chest event this weekend, making it easier for people to get golds from chests. His concerns over prices for his items losing mythical value is what began the haves-have nots/ elitists argument.

Personally, I believe that more available for all is great for the community. Others don't, and it's almost always the "haves" that complain the loudest.

Please do not start guessing what this post stemmed from (other posts are just that, other posts). It has nothing to do with the chest event. It has everything to do with this subforum being filled with "How come I can't have" and "Why does he get" threads.

I am not sure if there is any information in the OP that is really open for debate. No derogatory statements were made, it outlined what options are available (running, farming, chests, trading, HAing), and what ANET has done. If you really want to debate the FoW ebayer issue, fine. There will never be any actual statistics to support either side.

This will not start a "flame war" or some sort of "elite vs zen" battle. We were all noobs when we started this game... remember that.

MSecorsky · Aug 10, 2006, 04:33 PM // 16:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by milias

I tend to disagree. Just like IRL, this is how Capitalism should and does work. Capitalism does not guarantee equal wealth for all, for that, you'd have to look into Socialism or Communism. While those forms of government look good on paper, they don't work in practice.

Moreover, by redistributing wealth, you help some people, but you hurt others. Some people will be happy, and some will be upset. I think right now, it's best to maintain the status quo, because in any case, ANet does not want to see upset customers, be it the "haves" or the "have-nots".

You're right... in a capitalistic society.

Guild Wars, however, was not designed to be a capitalistic society. Hey, I'm as much a capitalist as Capitalist in real life, no doubts. However, in this game, the underlying concept of balance and equality trumps what we're used to seeing in the real world.

This isn't the real world, it's a game. Different concepts apply. Different patterns of thought are required.

No one mentioned redistributing wealth, by the way. No one that has will lose. Those that don't can get more easily. This is a good thing.